SAM Coupe core for MiST

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fury23
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Re: SAM Coupe core for MiST

Postby fury23 » Thu Jun 02, 2016 2:53 pm

Lyra III sounds fantastic on Mist! Thanks Sorgelig.

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Re: SAM Coupe core for MiST

Postby schombi » Thu Jun 02, 2016 5:41 pm

Many thanks for your ongoing support! I´m very happy with this core. Just for curiosity, any plans to integrate additional SAM hardware?

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Re: SAM Coupe core for MiST

Postby MasterOfGizmo » Fri Jun 03, 2016 6:21 am



I've taken quite a closer look at that. There are only minimal differences to the MISTs version of that core. Are you sure this one work better? If yes, what works better?
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Re: SAM Coupe core for MiST

Postby Newsdee » Fri Jun 03, 2016 11:36 am

According to their forum posts they improved the sound , timings for PAL games, better centering of the image.

Now that I think about it some of these could be due to their port instead of original issues in the MiST version. :( but the sound does feel a bit off and a few games won't run.

I ordered a ZxUno so whenever I get it I'll be able to compare more closely.

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Re: SAM Coupe core for MiST

Postby MasterOfGizmo » Fri Jun 03, 2016 5:15 pm

Yes, the sound ... imho there's a comment under some youtube video about a fix for the audio. I'll have to look for that and apply the fix.
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Re: SAM Coupe core for MiST

Postby MasterOfGizmo » Fri Jun 03, 2016 7:18 pm

Ok, found the comment and adjusted the audio pitch. Will check if there are more fixes we might have a use for. But maybe this discussion should not continue in the SAM Coupe thread ...
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Re: SAM Coupe core for MiST

Postby Newsdee » Sat Jun 04, 2016 12:15 am

MasterOfGizmo wrote:Ok, found the comment and adjusted the audio pitch. Will check if there are more fixes we might have a use for. But maybe this discussion should not continue in the SAM Coupe thread ...


Yes... let's move here :
viewtopic.php?f=101&t=29971

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Re: SAM Coupe core for MiST

Postby vebxenon » Mon Jun 06, 2016 9:29 am

Sorgelig wrote:New release:
- Don't mute tone when it used as source for envelope or noise.
- Fix noise volume (drums are better now).
So, i hope all problems of SAA1099 are fixed.
There is one strange behavior remaining: In second part of Lyra III (very good song for test of SAA1099) the main instrument has a little different sound than in Sim Coupe. But I'm not sure if SimCoupe has some strange settings because no matter if i select Stereo or Mono in intro part of Lyra III, i hear the same sound in part 2. In my emulator, if i select mono, then i hear exactly the same sound as in SimCoupe. But if i select Stereo then i hear panning sound in part 2 with little different timbre (due to panning i think).
So, this behavior is under question, but not really noticeable.


Great! :cheers: :cheers: Thanks again :-)

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Re: SAM Coupe core for MiST

Postby SirDavid » Mon Jun 06, 2016 11:58 am

I have just bought MiST and tested The Lyra 3 demo. The sound may seem perfect for someone who haven't heard the original, but I can hear a clear difference. At first, there are annoying... "pops" or "clicks" when SAA is switched on and off. For example at the start and the end of each part of the demo. And the whole sound seems a bit distorted. The original is more "gentle". I'm going to test more of course, but you were right, the second part of The Lyra 3 is a challenge and still sounds weird. I'm not sure, but maybe the sound is to loud when volume is lower then the maximum. I have to do more tests. But I have to say that I can't hear the difference between SAM and SimCoupe, so there's still room for improvement.

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Re: SAM Coupe core for MiST

Postby Sorgelig » Tue Jun 07, 2016 1:09 am

SirDavid wrote:I have just bought MiST and tested The Lyra 3 demo. The sound may seem perfect for someone who haven't heard the original, but I can hear a clear difference. At first, there are annoying... "pops" or "clicks" when SAA is switched on and off. For example at the start and the end of each part of the demo. And the whole sound seems a bit distorted. The original is more "gentle". I'm going to test more of course, but you were right, the second part of The Lyra 3 is a challenge and still sounds weird. I'm not sure, but maybe the sound is to loud when volume is lower then the maximum. I have to do more tests. But I have to say that I can't hear the difference between SAM and SimCoupe, so there's still room for improvement.


I know about clicks. I will try to eliminate it later.
My emulator uses compressor on final audio mix - may be that why you hear distortion on your setup.
I've attached version without compressor. Check if you still hear the distortion.
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Re: SAM Coupe core for MiST

Postby Sorgelig » Tue Jun 07, 2016 1:46 am

The source of clicks is mic_out bit in FE port.
It seams not used in SAM Coupe and thus set chaotically in different apps. I will disable output of this bit.

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Re: SAM Coupe core for MiST

Postby Sorgelig » Tue Jun 07, 2016 1:45 pm

SirDavid,
try to press "m" in the intro part of Lyra III to switch to mono and then listen part 2. Don't you think it sounds exactly the same as in SimCoupe?

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Re: SAM Coupe core for MiST

Postby Sorgelig » Tue Jun 07, 2016 7:15 pm

Well.. I don't see much activity here.
But i want to tell, that MiST has noticeable stereo cross-talking. May be this is interfering audio effect in Lyra III part 2.

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Re: SAM Coupe core for MiST

Postby SirDavid » Tue Jun 07, 2016 7:36 pm

The sound is much clearer now, distortion disappeared! I think it finally sounds like SAA. But something is still wrong, not only with The Lyra 3 - 2nd part. Playing it in mono doesn't change anything. I can also hear a clear difference in my demo - Back To The Past. I'm going to prepare a recording with comparison and it should be clearly noticable then.

Edit: I was wrong about mono in TL3.2 - it seems ok. But Back To The Past is not. At the begining, when the colorful BACK TO THE PAST logo is disappearing, there is a low frequency tone that is missing on MIST. But that tone is clearly heard, even too loud, in the oldest SAM Coupe core, when the overall emulation was very bad!

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Re: SAM Coupe core for MiST

Postby Sorgelig » Wed Jun 08, 2016 5:22 am

i think if i will be able to output SPDIF somehow from the MiST then i will be able to check if TL3.2 affected by channel cross-talking or by something else.
Can you record the part of BTTP where it sounds wrong?
Since you are developer of BTTP, may be you can tell how you produce that effect, so i will able to fix it faster?

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Re: SAM Coupe core for MiST

Postby Sorgelig » Wed Jun 08, 2016 7:12 am

Haha, i've fixed stereo cross-talking and TL3.2 sound!
It requires desoldering (removing) R21 resistor from PCB board.
No idea why it's there, but this resistor mixes L+R and destroys stereo envelope.

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Re: SAM Coupe core for MiST

Postby SirDavid » Wed Jun 08, 2016 7:58 am

Great! I have to remove R21 and check. And also check if it fixes BTTP. If not, I'm going to record only the channel causing problems, using ETracker.

The sound is not the only issue I've noticed, but I need to do more tests. For example something was wrong with booting disks (boot errors), but it seems ok in the latest, test core. Why there are two "Load *.DSK" in the menu? I suppose one of them automatically boots from the disk. If so, can you rename it to "Boot *.DSK"?

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Re: SAM Coupe core for MiST

Postby Sorgelig » Wed Jun 08, 2016 8:03 am

Two DSK options are for two disk drives. Since some disks aren't bootable, I've added support for second drive.
As you might notice the test version i've attached above already provides autoboot for drive 1.

I will make new release when we will sort out sound issues.

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Re: SAM Coupe core for MiST

Postby SirDavid » Wed Jun 08, 2016 8:16 am

Sorgelig wrote:Two DSK options are for two disk drives.

I've just figured it out myself :)

As you might notice the test version i've attached above already provides autoboot for drive 1.

Can you do autoboot as an option?

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Re: SAM Coupe core for MiST

Postby Sorgelig » Wed Jun 08, 2016 9:36 am

SirDavid wrote:
Sorgelig wrote:Can you do autoboot as an option?

Autoboot will happen only on initial stripe screen. If you don't want autoboot then press any key before loading the disk.

By the way, i've fixed one typo in SAA1099 code. So try attached version.
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Re: SAM Coupe core for MiST

Postby SirDavid » Wed Jun 08, 2016 7:58 pm

It works! After removing R21 the sound is just like it should be! Thanks a lot! And I'm glad you have removed clicks, too. I have also checked other suspicious cases, but all seems to be fine. Now, are you opened for some useful extra features? For example Z80 at 20MHz. All the demos from DTA Software Studio can use that extra speed.

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Re: SAM Coupe core for MiST

Postby NML32 » Wed Jun 08, 2016 8:45 pm

SirDavid wrote:It works! After removing R21 the sound is just like it should be! Thanks a lot! And I'm glad you have removed clicks, too. I have also checked other suspicious cases, but all seems to be fine. Now, are you opened for some useful extra features? For example Z80 at 20MHz. All the demos from DTA Software Studio can use that extra speed.

Is there a downside to removing R21 could it affect any of the other MiST cores?

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Re: SAM Coupe core for MiST

Postby Sorgelig » Wed Jun 08, 2016 9:07 pm

SirDavid wrote:It works! After removing R21 the sound is just like it should be! Thanks a lot! And I'm glad you have removed clicks, too. I have also checked other suspicious cases, but all seems to be fine. Now, are you opened for some useful extra features? For example Z80 at 20MHz. All the demos from DTA Software Studio can use that extra speed.

I'm glad that SAA1099 is finished at last!
Unfortunately, i cannot increase CPU speed due to MiST using SDRAM. Unlike in other my cores where i could use FPGA RAM for video cache, SAM Coupe uses whole 512kb for video. So i had to use SDRAM for video. Since SDRAM require significantly longer time than SRAM to access the data, there is no time left for increasing CPU speed (unlike in ZX core where i could achieve 56MHz).
So, the only thing i could do is to disable CPU Throttle to allow CPU work at full speed (6MHz) whole time.
Anyway, original SAM Coupe didn't have 20MHz, so there should be no big loss.

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Re: SAM Coupe core for MiST

Postby Sorgelig » Wed Jun 08, 2016 9:10 pm

NML32 wrote:Is there a downside to removing R21 could it affect any of the other MiST cores?

you can refer this discussion: https://github.com/mist-devel/mist-board/issues/25

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Re: SAM Coupe core for MiST

Postby Sorgelig » Wed Jun 08, 2016 9:35 pm

Not sure if option to disable 4MB required or not. Some boots on disks check extended memory and take extra several seconds upon boot while not really use extended memory.


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