Compiled binary architecture options?

No topic. Everything you want to speak about. Please just stay courteous.

Moderators: Mug UK, Silver Surfer, Moderator Team

User avatar
EmpireAndrew
Captain Atari
Captain Atari
Posts: 340
Joined: Fri Jul 15, 2016 5:46 pm
Location: NYC, USA

Compiled binary architecture options?

Postby EmpireAndrew » Thu Oct 20, 2016 7:44 pm

What are the types of compiled binaries possible on the Atari platform?

As in architecture wise?

I know code can be compiled for 68000 but will run on 68030, or code can be compiled for 68030 but will not run on a 68000.

Is there code compiled for say 060 accelerators only? I don't mean it needs a 060 for performance reasons, but literally that it will not run on a 030 due to architecture.

I know some apps may require a blitter, or may require (?) a DSP, but that's a separate consideration.
I'm talking processor architecture only.

So far I'm assuming there is only 68000 or 68030 compiled binaries? :shrug:
1977 VCS Heavy Sixxer (Boxed)
1990 Atari 1040STE, 4MB, UltraSatan, TOS 2.06, TT Touch -> Atari SC1435 Colour CRT Monitor
1991 Atari TT030, 2/16MB, Int 8GB Gigafile SCSI2CF, TOS 3.06, CaTTamaran Accelerator -> Atari TTM195 19" Mono CRT Monitor
1993 Atari Falcon030, 14MB, Int 4GB IDE2SD, TOS 4.04 -> Atari PTC1426 Color CRT Monitor
Amiga, Mac, DOS, Newton, SGI, Sun, NeXTStation and more!

User avatar
lp
Fuji Shaped Bastard
Fuji Shaped Bastard
Posts: 2171
Joined: Wed Nov 12, 2003 11:09 pm
Location: GFA Headquarters
Contact:

Re: Compiled binary architecture options?

Postby lp » Fri Oct 21, 2016 2:58 am

There MiNT kernel can be built in various flavors, up to 040 I think. Don't see to many apps the require an 060, none come to mind anyway.

User avatar
EmpireAndrew
Captain Atari
Captain Atari
Posts: 340
Joined: Fri Jul 15, 2016 5:46 pm
Location: NYC, USA

Re: Compiled binary architecture options?

Postby EmpireAndrew » Fri Oct 21, 2016 3:58 am

Interesting.

So there are 68000, 010, 020, 030, 040, 060 possibilities for binaries? And they are forward compatible so something compiled for a 030 would work on a 060 right?

What about math co-pro?
If it's compiled to support it then you have to have one in your system to run the app or does it use it if it finds it but otherwise not? (I assumed the latter)
1977 VCS Heavy Sixxer (Boxed)
1990 Atari 1040STE, 4MB, UltraSatan, TOS 2.06, TT Touch -> Atari SC1435 Colour CRT Monitor
1991 Atari TT030, 2/16MB, Int 8GB Gigafile SCSI2CF, TOS 3.06, CaTTamaran Accelerator -> Atari TTM195 19" Mono CRT Monitor
1993 Atari Falcon030, 14MB, Int 4GB IDE2SD, TOS 4.04 -> Atari PTC1426 Color CRT Monitor
Amiga, Mac, DOS, Newton, SGI, Sun, NeXTStation and more!

User avatar
lp
Fuji Shaped Bastard
Fuji Shaped Bastard
Posts: 2171
Joined: Wed Nov 12, 2003 11:09 pm
Location: GFA Headquarters
Contact:

Re: Compiled binary architecture options?

Postby lp » Fri Oct 21, 2016 4:39 am

Forward compatible to a point. Motorola decided to remove the movep instruction in later processors. So in that case no, not always. Most 060 based Atari's use a soft loaded patch (exception handler) to catch certain missing features like movep. Some have different stack frames. It basically comes down to the instructions, its possible to code in such a way it runs on all of them, even coldfire or vise versa. You could say coding for the lowest common denominator.

If an app requires an FPU and its not present, it won't work. Some apps can run with or without an FPU, it depends on the tools and libraries when it was compiled. Generally reading the docs is the key. ;)

User avatar
EmpireAndrew
Captain Atari
Captain Atari
Posts: 340
Joined: Fri Jul 15, 2016 5:46 pm
Location: NYC, USA

Re: Compiled binary architecture options?

Postby EmpireAndrew » Fri Oct 21, 2016 11:42 am

So realistically, on Ataris, the options are:

68000
68030 no copro
68030 with copro

Is any other app on our Ataris compiled for some other combination?
1977 VCS Heavy Sixxer (Boxed)
1990 Atari 1040STE, 4MB, UltraSatan, TOS 2.06, TT Touch -> Atari SC1435 Colour CRT Monitor
1991 Atari TT030, 2/16MB, Int 8GB Gigafile SCSI2CF, TOS 3.06, CaTTamaran Accelerator -> Atari TTM195 19" Mono CRT Monitor
1993 Atari Falcon030, 14MB, Int 4GB IDE2SD, TOS 4.04 -> Atari PTC1426 Color CRT Monitor
Amiga, Mac, DOS, Newton, SGI, Sun, NeXTStation and more!

joska
Fuji Shaped Bastard
Fuji Shaped Bastard
Posts: 3416
Joined: Tue Oct 30, 2007 2:55 pm
Location: Florø, Norway
Contact:

Re: Compiled binary architecture options?

Postby joska » Fri Oct 21, 2016 11:57 am

All of this depends on the settings of the compiler you use. With gcc you can compile code that only runs on a 68060, or a ColdFire for that matter. With "modern" compilers you typically compile code either for the 68000 (optionally with memory mapped FPU), the ColdFire or the 020-060 range. The latter means that the compiled code only contains instructions that is present on all CPU's in this range.

It is also possible to compile code that works on 020-060 and ColdFire.
Jo Even

Firebee - Falcon060 - Milan060 - Falcon040 - MIST - Mega ST - STM - STE - Amiga 600 - Sharp MZ700 - MSX - Amstrad CPC - C64

User avatar
EmpireAndrew
Captain Atari
Captain Atari
Posts: 340
Joined: Fri Jul 15, 2016 5:46 pm
Location: NYC, USA

Re: Compiled binary architecture options?

Postby EmpireAndrew » Fri Oct 21, 2016 1:16 pm

So if I'm following correctly, out there in the wild, as far as we know and discounting the "modern" Coldfire machine, the type of apps I may come across from back in the day are:

68000
68000 + FPU (?)
68030
68030 + FPU

And of course, the stuff able to use an FPU and compiled a such would not necessarily need an FPU depending how they were written.
1977 VCS Heavy Sixxer (Boxed)
1990 Atari 1040STE, 4MB, UltraSatan, TOS 2.06, TT Touch -> Atari SC1435 Colour CRT Monitor
1991 Atari TT030, 2/16MB, Int 8GB Gigafile SCSI2CF, TOS 3.06, CaTTamaran Accelerator -> Atari TTM195 19" Mono CRT Monitor
1993 Atari Falcon030, 14MB, Int 4GB IDE2SD, TOS 4.04 -> Atari PTC1426 Color CRT Monitor
Amiga, Mac, DOS, Newton, SGI, Sun, NeXTStation and more!

joska
Fuji Shaped Bastard
Fuji Shaped Bastard
Posts: 3416
Joined: Tue Oct 30, 2007 2:55 pm
Location: Florø, Norway
Contact:

Re: Compiled binary architecture options?

Postby joska » Fri Oct 21, 2016 1:25 pm

Most stuff compiled recently will either be compiled for 68000 or 020-060.
Jo Even

Firebee - Falcon060 - Milan060 - Falcon040 - MIST - Mega ST - STM - STE - Amiga 600 - Sharp MZ700 - MSX - Amstrad CPC - C64

User avatar
EmpireAndrew
Captain Atari
Captain Atari
Posts: 340
Joined: Fri Jul 15, 2016 5:46 pm
Location: NYC, USA

Re: Compiled binary architecture options?

Postby EmpireAndrew » Fri Oct 21, 2016 1:38 pm

Is there any stuff compiled for 030 only (i.e. something old and TT only perhaps?)

Surely some stuff needed an FPU?
1977 VCS Heavy Sixxer (Boxed)
1990 Atari 1040STE, 4MB, UltraSatan, TOS 2.06, TT Touch -> Atari SC1435 Colour CRT Monitor
1991 Atari TT030, 2/16MB, Int 8GB Gigafile SCSI2CF, TOS 3.06, CaTTamaran Accelerator -> Atari TTM195 19" Mono CRT Monitor
1993 Atari Falcon030, 14MB, Int 4GB IDE2SD, TOS 4.04 -> Atari PTC1426 Color CRT Monitor
Amiga, Mac, DOS, Newton, SGI, Sun, NeXTStation and more!

vido
Captain Atari
Captain Atari
Posts: 483
Joined: Mon Jan 31, 2011 7:39 pm

Re: Compiled binary architecture options?

Postby vido » Fri Oct 21, 2016 1:40 pm

Maybe NeoN Grafix?

User avatar
Eero Tamminen
Atari God
Atari God
Posts: 1482
Joined: Sun Jul 31, 2011 1:11 pm

Re: Compiled binary architecture options?

Postby Eero Tamminen » Fri Oct 21, 2016 10:49 pm

EmpireAndrew wrote:Surely some stuff needed an FPU?


AHCC doesn't include floating point emulation library, so if you compile code using floating point with it, it will work only machines that have FPU.


Social Media

     

Return to “Chat forum [ENG]”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 3 guests